INTERVIEW WITH FRANCES HARDINGE: THE ART OF BLENDING FANTASY, HORROR AND HISTORICAL FICTION GENRES

It is with the greatest of pleasures we welcome Frances Hardinge, one of Britain’s most outstanding writers for children and teenagers to the Ginger Nuts of Horror. Since her debut Fly by Night won the Branford Boase Award for best first novel back in 2006 her imaginative and unique brand of fiction has captivated millions of children across the world and has been widely translated. In 2015 Frances stunned the book world by scooping the Costa Book of the Book Award with her seventh novel The Lie Tree, a Victorian murder mystery. In winning this prestigious award Frances joins a tiny band of children’s authors (I can’t think of anyone else except for Philip Pullman!) who have won top-tier adult book prizes.

The joy of Frances Hardinge’s fiction partly lies in the fact that it simply defies categorization and is best described as a dark blend of fantasy, the supernatural, historical fiction with elements of horror bubbling under the surface. Her last three novels have been set in the English Civil War, the Victorian and Edwardian eras, however, her next tale, Deeplight, which is published in October is even more ambitious. Set amongst a huge collection of tiny islands in the alternative world of Myriad where the inhabitants search for the remnants of dead sea gods until a teenager unwittingly reawakens one of the most powerful creatures. At the time of the interview I had not yet read Deeplight, however, now having done so, it has all the hallmarks of a fantasy classic which will captivate the imaginations of children aged twelve and above.

Frances is one of few authors to win and be nominated for both major children’s prizes and those normally aimed at genre fiction. Such is her reputation, I have often seen horror legend Ramsey Campbell recommend Frances in online discussions, who seems to have a soft spot for Cuckoo Song! How many authors can claim to be nominated for awards as diverse as the prestigious Carnegie Medal for children and The James Herbert Award for Horror Fiction? Only Frances I would wager. Although Frances has won many other awards, another highlight came in 2015 when Cuckoo Song scooped the Robert Holdstock Award for Best Novel at the British Fantasy Society Awards.

Children need novels to transport them to faraway places where they can forget about the worries of social media, Instagram and Netflix. Few authors do this better than Frances Hardinge who in her nine-book career writes fiction which is as challenging as it is original. This thoughtful interview gives some insight into what makes her tick.

Whoever said this YA stuff was just for kids? I challenge any adult readers NOT to be captivated by Cuckoo Song, The Lie Tree or A Skinful of Shadows. After fifty pages you will have forgotten you are reading a supposed kid’s book! Or you could just treat your favourite niece, nephew or best friend’s child to one the outstanding novels covered in the interview. 

Frances Hardinge thank you for taking the time to chat with us today. We’re been fans for years and will try not to gush too much. So, onto our first question before we start blushing….

Did winning the main Costa Prize for The Lie Tree have a major impact on your career? With the exception of Philip Pullman, a YA author winning a major adult prize is the equivalent of meeting Elvis…

It’s changed everything. Before I was shortlisted for the Costa, I’d never been on TV. The day after I won the Costa Book of the Year, I spent twelve hours giving interviews and photoshoots for TV, radio and newspapers. My Amazon ranking was in single digits, and I was suddenly on a bestseller list for the first time in my life. It felt like I’d fallen down the rabbit hole into Wonderland.

My profile is much higher than it was, and I get invited to a lot more literary events, festivals and conventions than before, often in other countries. It’s all really lovely, and still feels a bit unreal. I half-expect to discover that I’ve accidentally been issued with somebody else’s life… but if I have, they can’t have it back.

Your fiction is dominated by supernatural themes; did you read much horror or dark fiction as a child? Who were your favourite authors?

The creepier aspects of Susan Cooper’s The Dark is Rising series, Alan Garner’s Elidor, Catherine Storr’s Marianne Dreams and tales like The Shadow Cage by Philippa Pearce had a big effect on my young and tender imagination. There was also a collection of horror stories that I borrowed from our primary school library, which sank long, dark roots into my brain. I’ve never been able to find that collection since, but it had a big effect on me.

As a rather odd teenager, I read quite a lot of classic 19th century horror, such as Frankenstein, Dracula, Carmilla by Sheridan le Fanu, the stories of MR James, The Strange Case of Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde, and The Family of the Vourdalak by Aleksey Tolstoy.

Do you read much adult horror? Or do you prefer other genres? Recommend us something amazing you read recently…..

I do read some adult horror, though I generally like it psychological rather than visceral. I also have a soft spot for books that are difficult to force into a single pigeonhole.

White is for Witching by Helen Oyeyemi is beautifully hard to categorise. It is certainly Gothic, and elusive, its meaning always sliding out of sight like a half-seen figure in one’s peripheral vision. It’s sometimes maddening, but always strange and haunting. One of the narrators is a house. It is definitely best not to trust the house, particularly with your life or sanity, but it may be unwise to trust anyone else either...

Most YA fiction is quite easy to categorise, on the other hand, your fiction is notoriously difficult to classify, often straddling genres in the most lyrical of ways. How does this go down with your publisher? I imagine you’re seen as a bit of a nightmare….

Everyone at Macmillan Children’s Books has shown superhuman patience and tolerance in the face of my contrariness. Not only do I have a cavalier attitude to genre boundaries, but my first six books perched on the cusp between upper middle grade and YA. I’m really awkward to classify. I’m surprised sales and marketing are still talking to me.

Much of your YA fiction is half-a-step from adult fiction, do you have any ideas for that market at some point in the future?

 I might write an adult book at some point, if I get enthusiastic about a story that suits that market. I’m likely to remain primarily a YA author, though, because I find it incredibly liberating and rewarding.

I’ve read most of your fiction and would say your work has gradually got more challenging, with your last three novels Cuckoo Song, The Lie Tree and A Skinful of Shadows particularly so, is this something you are aware of?

I certainly think of my most recent books as being ‘older’ than the earlier ones. When I write, my imagined reader is a younger version of me. My first five books were written for the twelve-year-old me. The more recent books are for the fourteen-year-old me.

Cuckoo Song, The Lie Tree and A Skinful of Shadows have all got particularly clever supernatural elements to them. Are any of the three inspired by folk tales or any other existing mythology?

Cuckoo Song is very much inspired by the old changeling folktales. I’ve been fascinated by the figure of the changeling since I was young, because as a child I had an irrational fear of doubles, doppelgangers and evil twins. I had nightmares in which somebody I trusted turned out to be something else impersonating them.

When I started reading the old changeling folktales, however, I discovered that they were chilling in ways I hadn’t expected. Perhaps the most disturbing aspect of those old stories was the way in which the human families reacted once they knew that they had a changeling in their midst. Changeling children (many of them babies) would be thrown in the fire, hurled into running water, beaten with sticks or left on dung heaps to scream. To my surprise, I found myself feeling sorry for the changeling.

Many aspects of Cuckoo Song are borrowed from the old changeling folktales. A tailor to see the truth. Eggshells and absurdity to flush out the imposter. A knife to hold the way open. A weaponised cockerel. A week of waning. A thing of sticks and leaves...

When you start writing a novel is it clear in your head whether it is aimed at children or a YA audience? Or does it evolve along the way? The reason I ask; in my experience a lot of kids, for example, try The Lie Tree, when they are a bit young to fully appreciate it….

Sometimes I know how old I think the book is, but sometimes the story has other ideas. Often it turns out to be darker and more complex than I expect. 

 I like challenging YA novels that force children to use their brains; there is enough space in the market for literary as well as easy to read rom-coms and crowd-pleasing page-turners. What separates your fiction from the majority of the market is the simple fact that you make the supernatural seem very real in vividly drawn historical settings. What’s the secret or your magic literary ingredient?     

Thank you, that’s very kind! I don’t think this really counts as a ‘secret’ or ‘magic ingredient’, but I genuinely enjoy historical research and world-building. I’ve now written three books in historical settings, five in fantastical worlds and one set in the modern day, and in each case fleshing out the setting was part of the fun and allowed me to understand my characters properly.

I also enjoy the challenge of taking a particularly absurd premise, and then thinking through as many of the mundane implications as possible, in order to make the bizarre and otherworldly feel palpable and convincing.

As an adult do you read much YA horror or dark fiction? We review a lot on Ginger Nuts, but most of the horror comes from America and is never picked up in the UK…..

 I do read some, but my TBR pile tends to be extremely varied, rather weird, and often made up of books that I’ve been unexpectedly sent.

What’s your fascination with writing in different time periods? In recent times you’ve covered the English Civil War, Victorian and Edwardian England and your attention to detail is extraordinary and becomes a key part of the story. Surely, there must be extensive research involved?

Yes, and I love it! For me, research is like treasure-hunting. I love discovering weird, macabre, funny, or interesting details that I can sneak into a book. Whenever I visit somewhere new, I’m always interested in hearing its stories – its myths and history – as well as seeing its sights. If you know the stories of a place, you have a glimpse of its soul.

I’m always particularly fascinated by times of revolution, aftermath and traumatic change. Cuckoo Song is set in the wake of the Great War. The events of The Lie Tree take place in the 1860s, not long after theories of evolution and geological discoveries shook everyone’s notion of the world and their place in it. A Skinful of Shadows is set at the start of the English Civil War, which turned everything upside-down to the point where some thought it was the Biblical end times. I like looking at the way people cope with such dramatic changes – which swim, and which sink.

Could you tell us a little bit about Deeplight which comes out later in 2019?

It’s set in an alternative, fantastical world, on a sprawling archipelago called the Myriad. For centuries the islanders lived in awe and dread of the grotesque and terrible gods that lived in the deeps. Then, thirty years ago, all the gods unexpectedly killed each other, and nobody knows why. In the three decades since, people have discovered that fragments of the dead gods have exciting and useful properties, so a diving and submersible salvage culture has emerged all over the Myriad. Finding valuable ‘godware’ can make your fortune.
My main character is fourteen-year-old Hark, who is eking out a living as a petty thief and con artist on a busy but down-at-heel island called Lady’s Crave. After his best friend Jelt gets him into even more trouble than usual, Hark finds himself in possession of a strange piece of godware. Impossibly, it seems to be alive...

Would I be correct in thinking the main character is a boy? You mainly have female lead characters? If so, this change is very welcome as female characters are currently dominating dark YA fiction, I say this based on the sheer imbalance of boy/girl leads in the novels Ginger Nuts has reviewed in the last couple of years…… 

This the second time I’ve written a male protagonist for a YA novel, the first being Ryan in Verdigris Deep. I also have male main characters in some of my short stories.

How far ahead do you plan when it comes to your writing, do you already know what comes after Deeplight?

This differs from book to book. Sometimes before I’ve finished one book I’m already enthusiastic about another idea. At the moment, however, I’m not quite sure what I’ll write next. I’m still having discussions with my editor about this.

It seems like a long time since you’ve written a novel in a contemporary setting, is this just because the elements of the fantastic you use play better in historical settings rather than the social media teen world of today?

 It all comes down to which idea pops into my head and obsesses me. If I became excited about a story that fitted the modern day, I’d use a contemporary setting.

I think some of the ideas that I have used genuinely do work better in a historical setting. In The Lie Tree, the core idea of a tree that feeds on lies and bears fruit containing secrets, only came to life properly in my head once I considered a Victorian setting. It was a time of respectable facades, double standards, sordid secrets and consensus lies – everything that a lie-munching tree could possibly desire. Immediately I found myself coming up with lots of ideas, and my main characters started to come into focus.

There has been some stuff in the press about the declining sales of YA titles, reasons given include the fact that too many ‘worthy’ or books about ‘issues’ are being published. What do you think about this statement? Your fiction avoids this sort of stuff, at least in any obvious sense….

 To be completely honest, I don’t read all of the articles talking about ‘what is wrong with YA’. There seem to be rather a lot of them, and apparently YA is too shallow, too deep, too dark, too light, too obsessed with issues, too escapist, read by too many adults and probably a bad influence to boot.

I rather love the fact that the books written by my fellow YA authors are so incredibly varied – fearless, funny, fantastical, hard-hitting, pacey, inventive, or quite often a combination of all of these.

Which of your books do you think would make the best film or TV show?

I would love it if The Lie Tree or Cuckoo Song reached the screen! Mind you, seeing the floating coffeehouses from Fly by Night or the volcanoes from Gullstruck Island would also make me very happy.

Which author, alive or dead, would you most like to walk past on a bus reading one of your novels?

My late grandfather (my mother’s father). He had to leave school at fourteen to help earn money for his family, but he was smart and determined, and continued educating himself. He became a teacher, started writing in his free time, and eventually had a dozen published titles. He died long before I ever got my first book contract, and I’d love to think of him reading my novels.

It has been a pleasure featuring you on the site and we would like to wish you every success with the upcoming publication of Deeplight.
Tony Jones